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Nov. 28th, 2022 01:43 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
skygiantsI saw cahn write up Lion Feuchtwanger's the Josephus trilogy last month and immediately put the first book, Josephus: A Historical Romance on my library pull list, because "dramatic historical epic in which controversial Romano-Jewish historian Titus Flavius Josephus is the sexy Romantic protagonist" is something I never knew I'd wanted until it was presented to me.
Despite the fact thatcahn was very clear about the context, I somehow failed to take into account that reading a book about the Roman wars against the Jews and destruction of the Second Temple in 70 AD, written by a German Jew in 1932, would in fact be an experience that generated a certain number of emotions ... fascinating! complicated! at times extremely rough!
The book begins with youthful Joseph's journey to Rome, on a journey that is equal amounts altruism and self-aggrandizement, to make his reputation by getting three elderly Jewish priests pardoned for having been caught up in protests against the Romans; he's successful, but the various politics involved around the project start a chain of dominos that eventually lead to the siege of Jerusalem with all its attendant horrors. It's a fairly clear-cut tragedy, in the classical sense -- Josephus' own actions lead to the loss of everything he values the most -- but also a really interesting and complex exploration of the period and the various kinds of Jewish existence within the Roman Empire, from the knife-edge multiculturalism of Jews living in Rome and Alexandria to the destructive nationalism of the zealots in Jerusalem. One of the major thematic plot points focuses on a successful Jewish actor in Rome who has embarked on a project to reclaim a popular Jewish stereotype as a role onstage -- it felt to me very clearly parallel to a Jewish actor deciding to play Shylock -- which terrifies Josephus simply because there is absolutely no knowing what the fallout will be; it could be a wildly successful opportunity to humanize Jews in the eyes of the Romans! or they could easily just ignore all the nuance and have a great time laughing at a Jew making himself ridiculous and double down on every negative opinion they have! who could say!!
Feuchtwanger also does an extremely good job of showing the various pressures acting on his historical figures and humanizing them as people. One of my favorite moments is when two Zealot leaders are facing defeat, and one of them is doomed to die and the other one isn't, and the doomed one is like "I think if we had done [x] we might have won," and the other one is like "well. This is our last moment. I will let him think he is right. Even though I know his idea is stupid." I don't care for most of the actions of these men and neither does the book, but that's human love!
Speaking of love: Joseph also has a rival named Justus, a cool-headed moderate who is constantly making unpopularly rational arguments, in opposition to Josephus who is constantly flinging himself into big causes and making extremely wild swings. Over the course of the book, Joseph has the following thoughts about Justus:
- "[Reginus] gazed at Joseph's lean pale brown face, and then at Justus's lean golden brown face. "Do you know, my friends," he said, "that you are very like each other?" They were both taken aback. They scrutinized each other: the jeweller was right. They hated each other."
- "Joseph's knees trembled. Suddenly the opinion of all Rome seemed to him unimportant as compared to that of this countryman of his, Justus of Tiberias."
- "[Joseph] sat in Justus' tent, stared at the sick man, and went over all the conversations he had had with him. The great discourse was not ended yet. Justus must not die."
- "Sleep would not have refreshed him, food would not have given him any pleasure, nor books knowledge, nor success contentment, if this Justus had been dead or had remained lost to him. He would have found no happiness in love; he would have written his book without any sense of satisfaction. But now he had found the man to measure himself against; the only man who was his equal."
The Great Discourse is not yet ended!! There will be NO HAPPINESS unless the callout posts CONTINUE. This is after Joseph has been given the power to rescue ONLY SEVENTY PEOPLE from the ruins of Jerusalem, and agonizedly scours the city looking for Justus, and then can't help but rescue seventy other people instead, and then is given the gift of rescuing SEVEN MORE PEOPLE because Titus happened to have a good day, and agonizedly scours the city AGAIN, finds Justus literally mid-crucifixion, cuts him down, hires the best doctors to take care of him, and then leaves before Justus -- who at this point considers him both a fool AND a traitor, reasonably enough given that Josephus is working directly for Titus -- can wake up and find out what happened and be burdened with gratitude to Joseph for saving his life, because that simply wouldn't be fair to The Discourse. Truly incredible.
The flip side of this is that Feuchtwanger does not do very well by his women, who are few in number and mostly exist to fall in desperate and ill-advised love, be symbolically raped, or both. Princess Berenice is the most interesting and nuanced as a dramatic parallel to Joseph who's caught between cultures on the various points of loyalty, principle, and ambition in a similar way and makes different but related choices, but the pattern nonetheless remains the pattern.
A final note: is also very fun to read a book set in 68-70 AD in which the topic of the Messiah frequently comes up but Jesus never does because he simply is not yet relevant to anybody there. My understanding is that this will eventually change but for now I'm having a great time with it. I did scream out loud with horrorlaughter when Joseph, caught in a tight How's Joseph Going To Get Out Of This One spot, confidently rolled a d20 on bullshit and declared proto-Emperor Vespasian the Messiah, and then screamed again when I checked Wikipedia and found out this was in fact a historical thing that really happened and a major cornerstone of Josephus' writings. MY GUY.
I am definitely going to read the rest of the trilogy, and probably more Feuchtwanger after that; however I am also definitely going to take a little break in between to build up my fortitude as this was certainly A Lot.
cahn write up Lion Feuchtwanger's the Josephus trilogy last month and immediately put the first book, Josephus: A Historical Romance on my library pull list, because "dramatic historical epic in which controversial Romano-Jewish historian Titus Flavius Josephus is the sexy Romantic protagonist" is something I never knew I'd wanted until it was presented to me. Despite the fact that
cahn was very clear about the context, I somehow failed to take into account that reading a book about the Roman wars against the Jews and destruction of the Second Temple in 70 AD, written by a German Jew in 1932, would in fact be an experience that generated a certain number of emotions ... fascinating! complicated! at times extremely rough! The book begins with youthful Joseph's journey to Rome, on a journey that is equal amounts altruism and self-aggrandizement, to make his reputation by getting three elderly Jewish priests pardoned for having been caught up in protests against the Romans; he's successful, but the various politics involved around the project start a chain of dominos that eventually lead to the siege of Jerusalem with all its attendant horrors. It's a fairly clear-cut tragedy, in the classical sense -- Josephus' own actions lead to the loss of everything he values the most -- but also a really interesting and complex exploration of the period and the various kinds of Jewish existence within the Roman Empire, from the knife-edge multiculturalism of Jews living in Rome and Alexandria to the destructive nationalism of the zealots in Jerusalem. One of the major thematic plot points focuses on a successful Jewish actor in Rome who has embarked on a project to reclaim a popular Jewish stereotype as a role onstage -- it felt to me very clearly parallel to a Jewish actor deciding to play Shylock -- which terrifies Josephus simply because there is absolutely no knowing what the fallout will be; it could be a wildly successful opportunity to humanize Jews in the eyes of the Romans! or they could easily just ignore all the nuance and have a great time laughing at a Jew making himself ridiculous and double down on every negative opinion they have! who could say!!
Feuchtwanger also does an extremely good job of showing the various pressures acting on his historical figures and humanizing them as people. One of my favorite moments is when two Zealot leaders are facing defeat, and one of them is doomed to die and the other one isn't, and the doomed one is like "I think if we had done [x] we might have won," and the other one is like "well. This is our last moment. I will let him think he is right. Even though I know his idea is stupid." I don't care for most of the actions of these men and neither does the book, but that's human love!
Speaking of love: Joseph also has a rival named Justus, a cool-headed moderate who is constantly making unpopularly rational arguments, in opposition to Josephus who is constantly flinging himself into big causes and making extremely wild swings. Over the course of the book, Joseph has the following thoughts about Justus:
- "[Reginus] gazed at Joseph's lean pale brown face, and then at Justus's lean golden brown face. "Do you know, my friends," he said, "that you are very like each other?" They were both taken aback. They scrutinized each other: the jeweller was right. They hated each other."
- "Joseph's knees trembled. Suddenly the opinion of all Rome seemed to him unimportant as compared to that of this countryman of his, Justus of Tiberias."
- "[Joseph] sat in Justus' tent, stared at the sick man, and went over all the conversations he had had with him. The great discourse was not ended yet. Justus must not die."
- "Sleep would not have refreshed him, food would not have given him any pleasure, nor books knowledge, nor success contentment, if this Justus had been dead or had remained lost to him. He would have found no happiness in love; he would have written his book without any sense of satisfaction. But now he had found the man to measure himself against; the only man who was his equal."
The Great Discourse is not yet ended!! There will be NO HAPPINESS unless the callout posts CONTINUE. This is after Joseph has been given the power to rescue ONLY SEVENTY PEOPLE from the ruins of Jerusalem, and agonizedly scours the city looking for Justus, and then can't help but rescue seventy other people instead, and then is given the gift of rescuing SEVEN MORE PEOPLE because Titus happened to have a good day, and agonizedly scours the city AGAIN, finds Justus literally mid-crucifixion, cuts him down, hires the best doctors to take care of him, and then leaves before Justus -- who at this point considers him both a fool AND a traitor, reasonably enough given that Josephus is working directly for Titus -- can wake up and find out what happened and be burdened with gratitude to Joseph for saving his life, because that simply wouldn't be fair to The Discourse. Truly incredible.
The flip side of this is that Feuchtwanger does not do very well by his women, who are few in number and mostly exist to fall in desperate and ill-advised love, be symbolically raped, or both. Princess Berenice is the most interesting and nuanced as a dramatic parallel to Joseph who's caught between cultures on the various points of loyalty, principle, and ambition in a similar way and makes different but related choices, but the pattern nonetheless remains the pattern.
A final note: is also very fun to read a book set in 68-70 AD in which the topic of the Messiah frequently comes up but Jesus never does because he simply is not yet relevant to anybody there. My understanding is that this will eventually change but for now I'm having a great time with it. I did scream out loud with horrorlaughter when Joseph, caught in a tight How's Joseph Going To Get Out Of This One spot, confidently rolled a d20 on bullshit and declared proto-Emperor Vespasian the Messiah, and then screamed again when I checked Wikipedia and found out this was in fact a historical thing that really happened and a major cornerstone of Josephus' writings. MY GUY.
I am definitely going to read the rest of the trilogy, and probably more Feuchtwanger after that; however I am also definitely going to take a little break in between to build up my fortitude as this was certainly A Lot.
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Date: 2022-11-28 08:46 pm (UTC)Goodness!
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Date: 2022-11-28 08:50 pm (UTC)"dramatic historical epic in which controversial Romano-Jewish historian Titus Flavius Josephus is the sexy Romantic protagonist" is something I never knew I'd wanted until it was presented to me.
RIGHT??
would in fact be an experience that generated a certain number of emotions ... fascinating! complicated! at times extremely rough!
Yeeeeeah. It's a lot!
One of my favorite moments is when two Zealot leaders are facing defeat, and one of them is doomed to die and the other one isn't, and the doomed one is like "I think if we had done [x] we might have won," and the other one is like "well. This is our last moment. I will let him think he is right. Even though I know his idea is stupid." I don't care for most of the actions of these men and neither does the book, but that's human love!
YES! And honestly Feuchtwanger made me care about all these guys as well, despite everything. (The one who lives shows up in the other books as well which is great!)
I also adored the three whom Josephus saved at the beginning making a surprise martyr appearance later on (at least, it was surprising to me!), that was amazing.
Joseph also has a rival named Justus
Joseph/Justus is TOTALLY THE JUGGERNAUT SHIP FOR THIS FANDOM
when it becomes a fandom. I'm just saying :D This could not have been written as MORE FRAUGHTLY SHIPPY if he had TRIED.(I do have bad news on this score, however -- possibly Feuchtwanger figured out what he was doing there, because in the third book, although Joseph is an Older But Still Sexy Romantic Protagonist, Justus has become a not-very-sexy character due to everything he's gone through. But we'll always have the first book, Justus!)
The flip side of this is that Feuchtwanger does not do very well by his women
Also true, as I warned you :) This gets mildly better in the third book -- the women are mostly still there for ill-advised love and/or rape, but there's one character who gets to have an actual personality and is totally my favorite :D
A final note: is also very fun to read a book set in 68-70 AD in which the topic of the Messiah frequently comes up but Jesus never does because he simply is not yet relevant to anybody there. My understanding is that this will eventually change but for now I'm having a great time with it.
It doesn't change very much! Like, I zeroed in on it when I was reading because it's honestly one of the few things I knew about Josephus before reading these books (because, uh, Christian), but it's definitely of the variety of "OMG this stupid random cult is SO ANNOYING" (with a Doylistic subtext of "yes, I know that most of the people reading this are Christian so here you go, I'm mentioning it!") so I think you'll enjoy it :D
when Joseph, caught in a tight How's Joseph Going To Get Out Of This One spot, confidently rolled a d20 on bullshit and declared proto-Emperor Vespasian the Messiah
RIGHT?? RIGHT?? I did the same thing and checked Wikipedia because I was like "that could not POSSIBLY... OMG THAT ACTUALLY HAPPENED."
I'm reading The Oppermanns right now! But it is actually set in the 1930's and I know enough about what to expect that it's going rather slowly. I shall report back, eventually. And I'm looking forward to you reading the rest as well! (But no hurry, it is a LOT.)
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Date: 2022-11-28 09:02 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2022-11-28 09:07 pm (UTC)I know this is contextual for the book series but also I giggled.
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Date: 2022-11-28 09:08 pm (UTC)And what is it, I asked with Jewish trepidation?
I did scream out loud with horrorlaughter when Joseph, caught in a tight How's Joseph Going To Get Out Of This One spot, confidently rolled a d20 on bullshit and declared proto-Emperor Vespasian the Messiah, and then screamed again when I checked Wikipedia and found out this was in fact a historical thing that really happened and a major cornerstone of Josephus' writings.
Have read Josephus, can confirm, find this hilarious.
(Have not read the book, am impressed.)
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Date: 2022-11-28 09:52 pm (UTC)WHAT this is AMAZING and I want to scream aloud with horrorlaughter too. OH JOSEPH... whatever lets you live to fight another day, I guess!
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Date: 2022-11-28 10:04 pm (UTC)It was a GENUINE RELIEF to quickly google and see that Feuchtwanger died in Los Angeles in 1958. (Wikipedia tells me he left for France in 1933, was briefly imprisoned but escaped, and had a series of harrowing adventures before arriving in the US as a refugee. I suspect at the time they seemed less like adventures and more like an unending nightmare.)
Anyway, this sounds AMAZING, I'm always hesitant to pick up books without women, but I'm definitely keen to experience it vicariously through you!
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Date: 2022-11-29 12:28 am (UTC)agonizedly scours the city looking for Justus, and then can't help but rescue seventy other people instead, and then is given the gift of rescuing SEVEN MORE PEOPLE because Titus happened to have a good day, and agonizedly scours the city AGAIN, finds Justus literally mid-crucifixion, cuts him down, hires the best doctors to take care of him, and then leaves before Justus -- who at this point considers him both a fool AND a traitor, reasonably enough given that Josephus is working directly for Titus -- can wake up and find out what happened and be burdened with gratitude to Joseph for saving his life, because that simply wouldn't be fair to The Discourse
And people make fun of fanfic. Tropes are tropey for a reason!
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Date: 2022-11-29 12:29 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2022-11-29 12:29 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2022-11-29 01:25 am (UTC)LOLLLL, oh history, history. You crazy, self-indulgent, Extra, unbelievable thing, you!
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Date: 2022-11-29 02:10 am (UTC)This sounds, as you say, like a Lot, but also like rather a lot of fun.
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Date: 2022-11-29 02:24 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2022-11-29 02:25 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2022-11-29 02:52 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2022-11-29 06:39 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2022-11-29 08:36 am (UTC)it felt to me very clearly parallel to a Jewish actor deciding to play Shylock
Bingo. I can't prove it, but I would be very surprised if Feuchtwanger, who was a theatre critic and dramatist before turning novelist (and btw became a mentor and friend of young Brecht, with whom he co-wrote some plays), hasn't been inspired by Fritz Kortner and his take on Shylock for this subplot. (I just linked you to Kortner's German wiki entry because the English wiki entry is minimal and doesn't say anything about Shylock as Kortner's role of a life time.) He played Shylock for the first time in 1916, and then on repeated occasions throughout his career, including in recorded performances post WWII. (Kortner like Feuchtwanger escaped to America in time to save his life, but lost several family members to the Holocaust.) The production Feuchtwanger most likely saw happened in 1927, directed by Jürgen Fehling in Berlin, and was glowingly reviewed by Alfred Kerr (=most famous critic of the Weimar Republic, also the Dad of children's book author Judith Kerr and hence immortalized in her book "When Hitler stole the Pink Rabbit"). To get an impression of Kortner's expressionistic style and why I think that's the model for the actor's performance in this novel, here is Kortner playing Shylock's most famous scene for a couple of theatre students. (In German, but you know the text.)
(Mind you, the "Apelles" stereotype apparently also was a real thing, which we know due to Josephus' writing an "Against Apion" book, Apion being a Hellenized Egyptian writer with a lot of antisemitic charges against the Jews which Josephus argued against in said book.)
Justus of Tiberias also was a real person whose writings are lost and whom we only know about because of his rivalry with Josephus, who therefore talks about him in his work. Making this into a life time intense frenemyship for Joseph, otoh, was definitely Feuchtwanger's narrative choice, and I agree that it feels incredibly slashy.
Female characters in the trilogy: true enough, though I will say Mara's development in the next two novels will pleasantly surprise you, and also there's a character introduced in later book 2 and becoming the most prominent female character in book 3 who, like
Oh, and a word of warning, the second novel has a bit of a middle installment of a trilogy syndrom, and also it's noticable that Feuchtwanger, who originally had intended to tell Joseph's story in two books, changed his mind (not least due to rl events of the mid 1930s) and split up the Titus and the Domitian era into two novels instead, with the result that there's some narrative water treading in the Titus middle book. But enough important character development happens that it really can't be skipped and I do get why he did decide it couldn't all be one book.
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Date: 2022-11-29 03:09 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2022-12-01 12:29 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2022-12-01 12:36 am (UTC)my friends, tolerant: what did Josephus do now
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Date: 2022-12-01 12:52 am (UTC)ahhh yes I'm so glad that John of Giscala comes back -- one of the throwaway lines I keep thinking about is when the Romans are watching their defeat procession, and one Roman senator is thinking about which defeated leader he'd like to claim for his household, something like 'one would be able to have interesting conversations with John of Giscala but on the other hand how exciting to have a High Priest as one's doorkeeper.' Just the casual callous power of the assumption that you can purchase this man to make him Available for Interesting Conversation! The surprise return of the three old men ALSO blew me away.
JOSEPH/JUSTUS IS SO POWERFUL. I can't believe I didn't save the quote where Joseph is dying of thirst, and starts hallucinating sexy women, and the sexy women turn into fruit and the fruit turns into JUSTUS! MYSTERIOUS. WHY COULD THIS BE.
I remembered that you had mentioned a woman you loved in book three and I am excited to get to her! I am also excited to get to the mentions of Christianity you describe tbh, that does sound like fun for me. >.> I'll be really intrigued to hear what you think about The Oppermanns, too -- honestly all of Feuchtwanger's oeuvre looks interesting to me now that I know to look for it!
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Date: 2022-12-01 12:56 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2022-12-01 12:57 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2022-12-01 01:02 am (UTC)IT'S SO FUNNY. Joseph talks himself in and out of actually believing it several times over the course of the book but in the moment it is clearly, obviously incredible bullshit and it's such a pull-a-rabbit-out-of-a-hat trick!
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Date: 2022-12-01 01:06 am (UTC)