(no subject)

[skygiants]

I am so close to the end of my great Discworld reread! Three more books and then I'm ALL CAUGHT UP.

But today it is time to talk about Thud, which . . . hmmm. I remember really liking Thud when it first came out, especially after being less than one hundred percent impressed with Going Postal -- I think because it fit my impression of How Discworld Books Went for comfort reading, which Going Postal did not at the time -- and now my feelings appear to have switched?

It's not that I didn't enjoy Thud, but -- well, and maybe this is a function of reading all the books so soon after each other, because it's like . . .

THUD: Guess what! Dwarves have wacky fundamentalist customs and don't want to integrate with Ankh-Morpork society!
BECCA: Oh, wait, again?
THUD: No, I mean different and EVEN MORE fundamentalist customs!
BECCA: I repeat: again?

Like, without even attempting to look at the Dwarves vs. Trolls Isn't Racial Hatred Terrible storyline through any kind of critical lens, I'm just kind of tired of dwarvish customs and society being retconned for use as the Metaphor Of The Week! I realize it is an exercise in futility to complain about continuity in Discworld, but NONETHELESS.

I am also -- and I never thought I would say this -- a little tired of The Power of Vimes' Internal Policeman, because, yes, okay, we know.

Which is not to say the ending doesn't work, because yes, the image of dead kings playing board games is super powerful, FINE, Terry Pratchett, you got me there. And it's not that I don't enjoy Angua, Sally and Cheery's Night Out, although that basically feels like extended fanfic about The Watch Girls Having a Night Out, but I'm okay with extended fanfic, I guess. And every time Sybil appears onscreen and/or reveals an undiscovered talent I am sent into a spin of wild delight. So I enjoyed Thud, there are lots of things I enjoyed, but . . . I'm okay with almost being out of Watch books.

Comments

[innerbrat]

I only read Thud! The once, and I remember being underwhelmed because I wait so long for a Watch Book and this is what I get?

I liked Sally, but she felt incidental to the plot, and I'll be honest, I never figured out what the book was about. I mean, even when Pterry's being horribly offensive, you usually know what he's being offensive about. What is he trying to say with Thud?

[skygiants]

I encourage other people to weigh in with guesses on what the plot is actually about! Like . . . fundamentalism? Fatherhood? Some weird combo? WE JUST DON'T KNOW.

[ceitfianna]

I loved some of the imagery in Thud and the Vimes' family moments but in terms of the story, I think he already told it better in The Fifth Elephant. This one had some weird touches like the secret in the painting, which was cool but random.

I remember enjoying it when I read it but I haven't reread it. I don't seem to reread the newer books as much as the older ones.

[skygiants]

Yeah, it feels a lot like this is a ton of themes from The Fifth Elephant kind of . . . remixed, and in a way I don't super love. Remixed and not as good!

[ceitfianna]

Yes, something must have inspired him. I mean I did like the idea of looking at history and what actually happened at Koom Valley, but it felt like he took that story and kept adding stuff on. Like the Darkness sigil/curse thing, which again an interesting idea but that was more about Vimes and didn't fit. Also true of the family stuff and Vimes managing being a father and Commander of the Watch. Normally his books seem to hold one sort of central idea, this one had too many.

I think he figured it out by the time he got to Snuff and Unseen Academicals, but this one was where it was obvious how and what he's writing about has been shifting. I still don't tend to reread the newer books as much as I do the older ones.

[skygiants]

I do really like Unseen Academicals! And I'm actually really looking forward to rereading it. I've heard mixed things about Snuff, so we'll see how that goes -- I'm curious to see how I feel about it anyway.

[ceitfianna]

I enjoyed Snuff but I also have a soft spot for the English countryside setting. I enjoyed it more than Unseen Academicals but I liked them both. I've just reread Snuff while I started a reread on Unseen Academicals and didn't finish it.

They both felt more English to me than others of his books and I found that helped them. I'll be curious to hear your thoughts.

[kate_nepveu]

I recently finished _The Fifth Elephant_ which I think is kind of a tipping point for Watch books for me. I really really do not care about Vimes and his relationship with his primal anger, it makes me want to roll my eyes whenever he goes all red in tooth and claw, and though it took someone else to point it out to me, his "get home to read to Young Sam" habit is in fact a dreadful abuse of power and not warm and fuzzy at all. So I'm really not looking forward to this one.

[skygiants]

Hah, it is SUCH an abuse of power! They SHUT DOWN TRAFFIC ON A MAJOR THOROUGHFARE. How many people didn't get home to read to their kids that night because some douchebag shut down traffic on a major thoroughfare?

I like Fifth Elephant, but as was said above I think this book just kind of . . . redoes Fifth Elephant in a lot of ways, a little bit less coherent and a little bit worse.

[kate_nepveu]

I also suspect that this book will be worse when it come to gender--_5E_ is actually pretty interesting in this regard, though I have qualms about whether (spoiler) is a tragic trans character--but I think the fact that I was surprised by the good bits of _5E_ indicates that it's only getting worse from here on out.

[skygiants]

Yeah, I side-eye that development in 5E a little too. But, like -- 5E was better than I respected in that regard, and this one . . . kind of honestly ignores that whole issue, which is probably for the best, but then you get a whole lot of dubious Wacky Funtime Slapstick Shenanigans with Sally and Angua's Night Out, and a recurrence of that archetype of The Beautiful Dumb Girl Who Makes Bad Dating Decisions so . . . there is all that. >.<

[kate_nepveu]

Are you skipping the YAs, by the way? I don't see _Amazing Maurice_ or the Tiffany Aching books in this tag.