skygiants | (no subject)

I quite enjoyed the Flora Segunda books when I read them over a decade ago, but I don't really want to reread the whole trilogy at this time. I have trilogies that I haven't actually yet finished reading that I ought to be reading instead!

Unfortunately I did just pick up [from the library sale] and read Ysabeau Wilce's short story collection set in the same universe, Prophecies, Libels and Dreams.

genarti, who happened to read this short story book before me despite having no context for Califa whatsoever, assures me that it's an enjoyable experience regardless of whether you've read the Flora Segunda books. For me, a person who did read the Flora Segunda books and has a vague memory of the fact that most of what I cared about was the Dramatic Parental Backstory of which the short stories fill in some brief and tantalizing snippets, it was simultaneously an enjoyable experience and an exercise in frustration. I don't think the novels ever fill in more than tantalizing snippets either, but they're different tantalizing snippets and I want to know what they were!

...this post therefore is mostly to say that if you have read the Flora Segunda books and you recall anything about the Dramatic Parental Backstory, please save me from myself by infodumping anything that you remember into the comments before I turn back to the trilogy that I don't have time to read.

If you haven't read the Flora Segunda books:

genarti says these short stories may be an enjoyable experience for you! The world is a highly fun and highly arch magical California; the prose walks the narrow and tottering tightrope of 'funny and charming' above the vast abyss of 'unbearably twee' (and occasionally falls in and has to pull itself out again); the snotty academic footnotes at the end of each short story explaining how the thing described in them almost certainly didn't happen are for me a real highlight of the ride. I especially liked the one about the thirst zombie (although I felt so, so sad for his pet armadillo) and the one about Tiny Doom going on a wig-stealing rampage. I have some very mixed feelings about the one about the chupacabra.

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From:

genarti

Can confirm! I did have the Califa context of you having described the Flora Segunda books to me over a decade ago, but that is not exactly detailed and in-depth context, and these stories were by and large a great experience, if one where I could feel various nuances and easter eggs whizzing right by me.

(Also, extremely agreed about the chupacabra one. The others were mostly just fun, for me if not necessarily the character; that one was... let's go with awkward.)

From:

sovay

(Also, extremely agreed about the chupacabra one. The others were mostly just fun, for me if not necessarily the character; that one was... let's go with awkward.)

What (kind of thing) went wrong?

From:

skygiants

a.) it's a Tall Tale set in the US army during the US-Apache conflict & very, very uncritically pastiching that style b.) & it's all just a setup to a mediocre punchline [& c.) wikipedia which I am consulting just now tells me that the chupacabra folklore originated in the NINETIES? I had no idea it was that modern!]

From:

sovay

a.) it's a Tall Tale set in the US army during the US-Apache conflict & very, very uncritically pastiching that style

Huh. Aside from the obvious issues, I thought the Califa timeline split off from ours before then.

b.) & it's all just a setup to a mediocre punchline

. . . fatal in and of itself.

[& c.) wikipedia which I am consulting just now tells me that the chupacabra folklore originated in the NINETIES? I had no idea it was that modern!]

I thought it was from the eighties! Damn.

From:

skygiants

It's the only one of the shorts set in our timeline rather than Califa's, and the thoroughly Califan framing narrative has several arch comments about speculative fiction as a result, which one the one hand is fun for the conceit but on the other hand I truly would rather just be reading more about Califa.

From:

sovay

From:

genarti

Because I haven't read the other books, I just assumed that it was part of the Califa timeline, and that for some reason Wilce had seen fit to AU-recreate the US-Apache conflict, with the snarky frame story commentary about its speculative nature referring to the chupacabra thing. All of which seemed unnecessary, but the kind of unnecessary that people doing alt-real world places sometimes do. Having it be the only story in which this conflict even exists, as a kind of alt-alt-history thing, is much weirder! And makes the uncritical pastiche even more awkward.

I almost wonder if she wrote that story separately, found it on her hands and at loose ends, and decided to pad out the collection by shoehorning it into the Califa setting? But that's pure guesswork.

From:

skygiants

I still think it's very funny that you ended up reading them before me tbh (and I'm delighted by it)

From:

sovay

a vague memory of the fact that most of what I cared about was the Dramatic Parental Backstory

You will be completely unsurprised to hear that Flora's disaster father is my favorite character in the series. I've never read the short story collection, though.

From:

skygiants

He might not actually be in the shorts at all -- the stories that tie into the Flora plot mostly focus on Hardhands and Tiny Doom. Buck gets a cameo at one point but I'm trying to remember if Hotspur ever shows!

From:

sovay

Buck gets a cameo at one point but I'm trying to remember if Hotspur ever shows!

Well, nuts.

Edited Date: 2023-08-18 03:23 am (UTC)

From:

starlady

I read the first book yonks ago and I've always meant to read the other two. Literally last night I was thinking about picking up the short story collection first, as it's sitting on my TBR shelf and has been for a while. I do not recall the Disaster Parents Backstory at all.

From:

skygiants

The Disaster Parents Backstory was the best part! Before picking up the shorts I had very little memory of the specifics of the plot but a strong understanding that I was Very Compelled by some people called Buck and Tiny Doom, either or both of whom might be Flora's mother, and who were important to each other in some messy and complicated and betrayal-filled and potentially very romantic way.

From:

chestnut_pod

Magical California?! How have I never heard of these?

(Is it… a racist chupacabra?)

From:

skygiants

The first was published in 2007 and the last one came out in 2012, so perhaps they were a bit before your time? Specifically they're magical San Francisco and having so much fun at being so -- I was at school in that area when I was reading them and half the fun was just seeing what she'd done to the landmarks.

(the story isn't really actively racist, but it's uncritically pastiching such a racist genre & era of literature that I spent the whole story braced for impact like someone on the slow climb of a roller coaster)

From:

osprey_archer

Ask and you shall receive! I was apparently so overwhelmed by the Dramatic Parental Backstory in the Flora Segunda books that I devoted an entire post to recounting it! I reread that today and WOW, what a wild ride, I had forgotten all of that, and indeed everything about these books except that I enjoyed them, and also that Flora was always calling sandwiches "sandwies."

Apparently (looking at my Ysabeau Wilce tag) I confidently expected a fourth book to come along any day, and I guess in a sense this book is it? But it sounds like the short stories don't pick up the Flora Segunda story where it left off.

From:

jadelennox

oh this is great because every time i reread these I need to rebuild the family tree in my head.

From:

skygiants

to be honest I think I remember your Yuletide fic for these books better than I remember the books themselves

From:

skygiants

YES thank you this is exactly what I was looking for and what I foolishly did not do for myself! All I learned from looking at my old posts is that I apparently also confidently expected a fourth book to come along any day now back in 2012, so I went trotting off to Ysabeau Wilce's social medias to see if any such thing was forthcoming, and instead learned that she instead seems to be working on a.) a MASSIVE prequel tome about Hardhands (Flora's mother's poisoned husband) (which does make sense as several of the shorts focus on him and also she clearly had SO MANY backstory thoughts vying for freedom) and b.) a lot of Our Flag Means Death meta.

From:

osprey_archer

a lot of Our Flag Means Death meta

That absolutely checks out. And so does the prequel book, as I do think that at some point her feelings about the parent generation overtook her interest in her original protags...but also I would like some wrap-up for Flora's story! Alas, it sounds like we'll never get it.

From:

aella_irene

I seem to remember a short story which revealed that a) Hardhands was Tiny Doom's maternal uncle b) he had an affair with Tiny Doom's father c) Tiny Doom's father killed her mother, and the marriage was part of the custody battle which fizzled out when Hardhands killed TD's father with poisoned lip gloss.

From:

sovay

I confidently expected a fourth book to come along any day

Ditto! It did not end like a trilogy.

From:

kadharonon

I think I stopped reading them before the third book came out and never picked them up again, but now that you've reminded me of them I probably ought to go do that.